The NewsHour with Jim Lehrer

no income for a dyed in the wool notre dame fan like me to say something good about the university my and you can be sure that they aren't they've done a great job the program includes the presidential debates began in nineteen eighty seven and we've conducted that every four years presidential debate sets our job in addition to producing these debates is to conduct educational programs and forums across the united states research on debates in addition a very interesting new prospect of democracy are spread around the world was a great deal of time with political parties and groups from other countries are interested in instituting debates and in their land in their elections much of the work that has been done is thankful to we're thankful to a great board of directors who really don't get as much credit as they should not i'd just you and pulls out a

great environmentalist from illinois has made great contributions to the commission both financially as well as with his time and effort one of the members who is with this tonight and one for chili's retiring from the congress of the united states it's a great loss to the people and in her home district a great loss for the congress and the people in other states like to recognize or congresswoman jennifer dunn the state of washington never commissioners antonio hernandez oldest of the state of california los angeles she's the former president of the mexican american legal defense fund and tony has been with us for many many years now the member of the commission is caroline kennedy of new york doctor and also the president of the john f kennedy foundation of course named after the late president her father newton minow attorney sidley and austin in chicago and a former chairman of the federal communications commission has been with us for many years and we

were was that i knew another member of our board who is with us in the audience tonight she's the former president of the league of women voters and presently serves as the president council on foundations are the writings that we're using that instead of age backwards weigert is the president of howard university in washington dc at the most and i catch up with a lot of some of the other debates is you know there's going to be a vice presidential debate in two presidential debates to follow a couple of members of our board had to resign for different reasons in the last month and a half we won't recognize them for four years of hard work forces former senator jack and forth of the state of missouri was you know is our new ambassador to the united nations and pentax doing a great job there and he's been such a strong supporter of the commission and former wyoming senator alan simpson who's out on the campaign trail and will be for the next few months so we fact allen for the work that he's done the before

it was my my colleague and coach yeoman something we have to do and that is that the two gentlemen who are going to be at these proteins the i mean a few moments our have spent a great deal of time effort and hard work to get here that this debate is for the millions and millions of americans where the whole night to watch this on television and we ask you to please don't inject yourself as protests that either by clapping your whistling or yelling or any other device you might have in mind and it's for these gentlemen to present their case to the american people so we asked for your indulgence i n and tie your silence until the debate is over and then i hope you'll give them a tremendous fan of the job that they're going to do is now my pleasure to introduce my colleague of seventeen years in this work our fallen i when he was chair of the democratic national committee and i was chairman republican national committee fought like cats and dogs but we learn to disagree agreeably and

i'm proud to say that after seventeen years he's not only my colleague a protocol in my friend and that's the massachusetts poker like very much like to fry as debates become increasingly important in our electoral process system for voter education it's no accident that the commission chooses as hosting the newsroom on the finest educational institutions in the country and tonight from the university of miami and coral gables and the three debates will fall a worldwide audience an american audience will have a voter education opportunity quite different from the clutter of television prepackaged television as the weeks have been on the airwaves over the past months tonight ann of the three debates that will fall this is an

opportunity for four wide audience to see the two candidates for president and vice president of the united states a leading candidates face to face side by side to see hear and compare their accountability for his stewardship of the past and listen to their alternative plans and visions for the future it is not too much to say that the kind of country and the world that awaits us we made the judgment by the american people on november second and it is our mission to try to make sure that the american people have a more informed judgment when they cast their ballots so that's why we're here is the most serious business we could be about in our democracy and the pleasure of the commission do a lot of hard work went into the preparation of these debates in your program you'll see a page

devoted to salute to those cordoned behind the scenes and done a great job for us there's another mentioned we're a nonprofit an organization we knew we repeat they receive no public funding and no political party funding responses pages in your program as well but i want to particularly salute them they've been so generous to the sponsorship of these debates aarp american airlines america's charities yen has a boyish corporation howard j profit foundation sheldon as conan morgan lewis and raucous continental airlines discovery channel e ds jet blue airways and the color of fun and if you would mind giving them a good man the problem now i have the pleasure to introduce a woman who's devoted her life to higher education and public service and serves with great

distinction as the president of the great university of miami oh thank you very much thank you i want to thank the commission for the opportunity given the opportunity to the university of miami the host of this first presidential debate and i have a number of banks first who are great governor and three mayors mayor pinellas mayor diaz and that mayor dallas last night who supported us from the beginning i ought to put on this debate we'd like to dedicate our efforts to our fellow floridians who have gone through so much in the last few weeks and showed such courage and recent events and we of course want to thank our board of trustees led by dr philip ross who with his wife pat is here tonight i'd like you to meet that the frost thank you this debate would not have

occurred if we didn't have the gentle it the underwriting up from the miccosukee tribe of florida chairman billy cyprus is here and i want you to thank him with all of us they gave us an extraordinary get thank you mr chairman this debate for our students we believe this election this debate is very much about their future about their health or welfare and their security and therefore we have given all the tickets are allocated the university of miami to our students who are spread all over the room the pure grease in this room is registered to vote in november and they have a lot of voter registration drive and matched ah among universities in this country we've had a

series of lectures lots of academic programs surrounding this debate because we want to emphasize civic leadership and the importance of american politics it in our life but more than anything else we want to make sure that every student had an opportunity so i've actually given up my own ticket to a student at the university of miami in choosing the student i wanted someone who was short and fast and so i chose a senior at the university you will graduate indies stamberg was majoring in finance in our school of business who won the silver medal at the olympics in the one hundred let me introduce you to lauren williams it's been given the opportunity to play the pain has been donna thank you very

much there are dozens and dozens of people and president shalala staff who have have helped with tonight i'm in a name three who are representative of this whole campus eileen you go mammoth light at

relieving time when i pull in washington welcome to our special coverage of the general election's first presidential debate in two thousand for you now looking at a live shot of the convocation center at the university of miami in coral gables florida that's clear is just a few moments president george w bush and sen john kerry will take questions from the moderator of tonight's today our own jim lehrer this'll be the first time the nominees of the two major parties will meet face to face but it will not be the last candidates are expected to debate twice more in the next two weeks for the next ninety minutes so nice topic is foreign policy and homeland security were each man will get the opportunity to lay out his competing ideas and disagreements about the war in iraq terrorism and presumably other issues as well their running mates will debate is next tuesday in cleveland after the debate will turn to mark shields and david brooks for analysis to partisans on either side republican c boyden gray and democrat donna brazil and for the long view to historians michael beschloss richard norton smith

and ellen that spacek know i have that killed fifteen more seconds before i get to jim lehrer i will slow down a cash i were all i want the things i can play with for fifteen seconds oh no i do i realize i actually had thirty seconds and i think that i had a russian analyst at mit than not yes please yes please at an evening time when i fall in washington welcome to our special coverage of the general election's first presidential debate of two thousand for you now looking at a live shot of the convocation center at the university of miami in coral gables florida that's where in just a few moments president george w bush and sen john kerry will take questions from the moderator of tonight's debate

our own jim lehrer this will be the first time the nominees of the two major parties will meet face to face but it will not be the last the candidates are expected to debate twice more in the next two weeks for the next ninety minutes tonight's topic is foreign policy and homeland security each man will get the opportunity to lay out his competing ideas and this agreement it's about the war in iraq terrorism and presumably other issues as well their running mates for me to debate next tuesday in cleveland after the debate will turn to mark shields and david brooks for analysis two parties is from either side republican c boyden gray and democrat donna brazil and for the long view to historians michael beschloss richard norton smith and ellen fitzpatrick now to coral gables and where i feel that in another paragraph here ok

what has been the public that's another that's weldon okay thank you andrew and forced the rules and i'll feel free to to enlist anybody else you'd like your and your endeavor as i say this is not just some gun again this is very serious business and i got a lot on my mind that they'd these rules that have this debate tonight or complicate and that i got to concentrate on what's going on up here are a little worried that about you also a number and i know you're going to cooperate we've been here before many many have most of you been here before a band or something like this before you know what the deal is here for some reason there is some kind of out of noise and the un has been raised my right arm and that means much first second third and last i noticed now are two obsessions two exceptions one at the very beginning and one of the very end of the tale this is gonna

work in a few minutes i'll take my seat here and i will hear some noise in the background at the network deals up there you'll hear people other than the enemy saying that even an online source of what they are doing is putting their programs on the air and then a man and a half later i will say good evening there's a teleprompter don't tell my body and is until about revival and i think that i i memorized any others a teleprompter in there and i was a very new now put this program on the air explained in detail what the rules are everybody was watching and then and i will say the following at the very end of this is about a little over a minute opening i'm going to say there is an audience here in the hall but they will remain absolutely silent for the next ninety minutes and then i will say it takes effort now when they would join me in welcoming senator kerry and president bush and then at that

point feel free to applaud ok and then they're going to come out senator kerry can come out from outside president bush's going to come up in the us either gonna come right here to the center of the state shake hands go behind their respective korean and ball i'm not as the first question so one eye you hear me see me go like that another look at of real problem a command when i go like that haas they were beyond what would always a time now at the very insular tricky here so bear with me on this when we get to the very end there each of canada has it always been determined by the way first question all this an ma poses a recipient of them determined by going to coin tosses so the order for the two minute closing statement senator kerry will go first and then president bush will go second and when they lost money seven fishes they finish their second then i will then another bank and i'm going to say anything to them they're going to stand stay there behind their

podiums and then on to close it out we go back to the teleprompter tell people about the next two presidential debates and the vice presidential debate coming up and that i will say thank you president bush and senator kerry and then i'll say from coral gables florida etc thank you and goodnight and then i will start i will stand up and start applauding and i will be your signal to do this say okay and i think it says it makes all the sense in the world and be out the clue what one other little thing probably won't even meet be relevant but i want to i don't want to be surprised in that we use it these rules are designed to really see these lights and you'll see them the others that there's a the green line and amber ly and a red light and i'll explain to you here if

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washington welcome to our special coverage of the general election's first presidential debate of two thousand for you are now looking at a live shot of the convocation center at the university of miami in coral gables florida that's where in just a few moments president george w bush and sen john kerry will take questions the moderator of tonight's debate our own jam where we see sitting there working this will be the first time the nominees of the two major parties will meet face to face but it will not be the last candidates are expected to debate twice more in the next two weeks for the next ninety minutes tonight's topic is foreign policy and homeland security were each man will get the opportunity to lay out his competing ideas and disagreements about the war in iraq terrorism and presumably other issues as well their running mates will meet to debate next tuesday in cleveland after the debate will turn

to mark shields and david brooks for analysis to partisans from either side republican c boyden gray and democrat donna brazil and for the long view to historians michael beschloss richard norton smith and ellen fitzpatrick and now we go to coral gables florida and to jim lare good evening from the university of miami convocation center in coral gables florida i'm jim lehrer of the newshour on pbs and i welcome you to the first of the two thousand for presidential debates between president george w bush the republican nominee and senator john kerry the democratic nominee these debates are sponsored by the commission on presidential debates tonight's will last ninety minutes following detailed rules of engagement worked out by representatives of the candidates i have agreed to enforce their roles on them the umbrella topic is foreign policy and homeland security but the specific subjects were chosen by me the questions

were composed by may the candidates have not been told what they are nor has anyone else for each question there can only be a two minute response a ninety second rebuttal and at my discretion a discussion extension of one man a green light would come on when thirty seconds remaining in any given answer yellow at fifteen read at five seconds and then flashing red beans times are there's also a backup buzzer system if needed candidates may not direct a question to each other there will be two minute closing statements but no opening statements there is an audience here in the hall but they will remain absolutely silent for the next ninety minutes except for now when they join me in welcoming president bush and senator kerry

baby and residents senator kerry goes to use the military do you believe that you could do a better job than president bush in preventing another nine eleven type terrorist attack on the an audience state yes i do but before i answer further let me thank you for moderating wanna fight the university of miami for hosting us and i know the president will join me in welcoming all of florida to this debate you

been through the roughest weeks anybody could imagine our hearts go out to you and we admire your clock and perseverance i can make america safer than president bush has made us and i believe president bush and i both love our country legally but we just have a different set of convictions about how you make america safe i believe america's safest and strongest when you're leading the world and when you're leaving strong alliances i'll never give a veto any country over our security but also know how to lead those alliances this president has left them and shutters cross the globe and we're now ninety percent the casualties arrive to ninety percent of the costs i think that's wrong and i think we can do better i have a better plan for homeland security i've a batter plan to be able to fight the war on terror by strengthening our military strengthening our intelligence by going after the financing more authoritatively by doing what we need to do to rebuild the

alliance's by reaching out to the muslim world which the president is almost not done and beginning to isolate the radical islamic muslims not have them isolate the united states of america i know i can do a better job in iraq rival plan to have a summit with all the allies something this president is not yet achieved not yet been able to do to bring people to the table we can do better job of training iraqi forces to defend themselves and i know that we can do a better job preparing for elections all of these and especially homeland security which we'll talk about a little bit later as president you have ninety seconds or balk at that to thank the universe in miami an end and say our prayers with the good people of the state have several i come september eleventh changed america must look at the world and since that day our nation has been on a small type prong strategy to keep our country safer

we pursued our cattle were out there tries to hide seventy five percent of non out their leaders have been brought to justice the rest of nowhere for them we upheld the darkness at harvard terrorist you're equally as guilty as a terrorist the taliban no longer power ten million people are registered to vote in afghanistan and the upcoming presidential election interact we saw threat and we realize that after september the eleventh we must take threats seriously before the forelimb materialize saddam hussein who now sits in prison so american workers safer for it we continue to pursue our policy of disrupting those who proliferate weapons of mass destruction libya's disarmed the aq khan network has been brought to justice as well we're pursuing a strategy of a freedom around the world understand free nations or reject her free nations where for the hopes and aspirations of people free nations world was she the piece we all want

new question mr president two months do you weigh the election of senator kerry on november the second would increase the chances of us being hit by another nine eleven plotters that their leaders can happen i'm away and because the american people normally have shown the american people and hopefully hire you alastair learned this country don't agree with the decisions i made that made some tough decisions would be one or i stand people out there listening to what i believe and sms is to keep the peace but this nation of ours he's got a solemn duty to defeat this ideology of hate that's what they are this is a group of jurors who will only chill here would kill children

and russia will attack and more civilians a rack hoping to shake or will we have a duty to defeat this enemy we have a duty to protect our children grandchildren the best way to defeat him is a never waiver to be strong to every us at her disposal mr casale stay on the office and at the same time spread liberty and that's what the people are saying that happening in afghanistan ten million citizens and registered to vote is a phenomenal statistic they're going to just be free it will show up a poll forty one percent of those inmates are women interactive that no doubt about it is tough it's hard work it's incredibly hard you know why because an enemy realizes the state the enemy understand say for iraqis will be a major defeat in their ideology of hatred as whether fighting so vociferously they showed up in afghanistan when there were there actively try to be

decimated and they're showing up in iraq for the same reason are trying to defeat is and if we lose or will we lose that we are a strong and resolute we will defeat this enemy terry i believe in being strong and resolute and determined and i will hunt down and kill the terrorists wherever they are but we also have to be smart jim smart names not diverting your attention from the real war on terror in afghanistan against us on the line and taking it off to iraq or the nine eleven commission confirms there was no connection to nine eleven itself inside in the same and where the reason for going to war was weapons of mass destruction not the removal of saddam hussein this president has made i regret to say a colossal error of judgment and judgment is what we look for in the president united states of america i'm proud that import military figures are supporting me in this race former chairman joint chiefs of staff john

shalikashvili just yesterday general eisenhower son joel john eisenhower and doris day a general abnormal william crowder general tony magee who ran the air force or so effectively for his father all believe i would make a stronger commander in chief and they believe it because they know i would not take my eyes off of the bowl osama bin ladin unfortunately he escaped in the mountains of tora bora we hadn't surround we didn't use american forces the best trained in the world to go to one president relied on afghan warlord city outsourced that job to that's wrong no question two minute senator kerry colossal misjudgment what colossal misjudgment so in your opinion as president bush made in these areas well we learned first of all he made the misjudgment of saying to america that he was going to build a true alliance that he would exhaust the

remedies of the united nations both with the inspections in fact he first anymore do that and it wasn't until former circus state jim baker general scowcroft and others bush publicly and so you got your view and that the president finally changed his mind but his campaign has a word for that and went to the united nations now once there we go to continue those inspections with some say trapped he also promised america that you would go to war as a last resort those words mean something to me as somebody who's been in combat last resort yet to look in the eyes of families inside of those parents i tried to do everything in my power to prevent the loss of your son and daughter i don't believe the united states did that we pushed our allies aside so today we are ninety percent of the casualties in ninety percent of cost two hundred billion dollars two hundred billion dollars it could've been used for health care for schools for construction for prescription drugs for seniors and its interactive

anorak is not even the center of the focus of the war on terror the center's afghanistan where incidentally there were more americans killed last year than the year before where the opium production is seventy five percent of the world's opium production where forty to sixty percent of the economy of afghanistan is based on opium where the elections have been postponed three times the president moved the troops as get ten times the number of troops in iraq that he has in afghanistan where osama bin ladin is does that mean that saddam hussein was ten times more important than osama bin laden that their marriages some say more important than osama bin laden i don't think so guys i looked at the same intelligence and declared in two thousand to sometimes it was a great threat he also said in december of two thousand three that anyone who doubts that the war was safer without saddam hussein it does

not have the judgment to be president of iraq without saddam hussein i was open diplomacy work understand the serious consequences of committing more troops in the harms way is the hardest decision a president might say i want the united nations i don't need anybody to tell me to go the nine nations are deciding on their myself and i went there hoping that once and for all the free world would act in concert to get saddam hussein to listen to our demands they pass resolutions that disclosed disarm or face serious consequences that belief when an international body speech it must mean what it says the sound was and had no intention of disarming why should he had been sixteen other resolutions and up into place as a matter fact that my opponent talked about inspectors the facts are that he was systematically deceiving inspectors at when their work it's kind of a pre september

tenth mentality the hope that somehow resolutions and failed inspections would make this world a more peaceful place he was open we turn away but there's boar chili others beside myself who believe that we ought to take action we did the world safer without saddam hussein new question mr president or two minutes more about senator kerrey's point the comparison he drew between the priorities of going after osama bin ladin and going after saddam i generally get him billy beane both smart fact this is a global effort we're facing a a group of folks who have such hatred in their heart the strike anywhere with any means and that's why it's essentially we have strong alliances and we do slice essential that we make sure that we keep weapons of mass destruction of the hands of

people like al qaeda which we are but to say that there's only one focus on the ward tara doesn't really understand the nature of the war on terror of course we're after saddam hussein come in have been law and he sees he's he's isolated seventy five percent of his people have been brought to justice the turin the mastermind of the september eleventh attacks khalid shaikh muhammad is in prison we're making progress but the front of the sort of more than just one place the philippines we get help were helping him there to bring to bring out that i feel is that just as there and of course a rack is essential for a water that's wiser collins people are trying to fight is their hope is that we're grown weary and we leave the biggest disaster that could happen is that we not succeed interact we will succeed we got a plan to do so and the main reason was succeeded because iraqis wanna be free andy are visiting the prime minister allowing he's a

strong courageous leader he believes in the freedom in iraqi people he doesn't want us leadership however to send mixed signals but now stand with iraqi people he believes like i believe that the iraqis are ready to fight for their own freedom that is needed help to be trained there will be elections in january were spending reconstruction money and our lives as strong as the plan for the dream when i read is remarkably more secure mr gary ninety seconds the president has talked about a rock as a center of the war on terror a rack he's not even close to the center of the war on terror for the president david the president made the judgment to divert forces from under general tommy franks from afghanistan before the congress even approved to begin to prepare to go to war in iraq and he rushed or interact without a plan to win the peace and that

is not the judgment that a president united states ought to make not take american war alicia plan to win the peace you'd send troops to war without the body armor that they need on their kids in ohio parents in wisconsin places iowa where they're going out on the internet to get the state of the art body gear to send their kids someday god for birthday present i think that's wrong humvees ten thousand or twelve thousand humvees are over there are armor and you visit some of those kids in hospitals today were maimed because they don't have the arm there's president just i don't know he sees what's really happened on there but it's getting worse by the day more soldiers killed in june and before borat july than june or august and july more and september then in august and now we see beheadings and we get weapons of mass destruction crossing the border every single day in there blowing people up and we don't have enough troops there they'll tell you that the story about one of these one minute extension of thirty seconds

for so what my mom what you forget is that he won't authorize the use of force and now says it's wrong order wrong time wrong place i'll say you can lead this country that has seen a wreck it is a wrong war wartime won't little messes that send our troops what misses the center allies what messes the us and iraqis not the way to win this is to be steadfast and resolved and follow through on the plan that i've just outlined thirty seconds yes we have to be steadfast and resolved and i am and i will succeed for those troops now that we're there we have to succeed we can't leave the failed around but that doesn't mean it was a mistake in judgment to go there and take the focus off osama bin ladin it wants now we can succeed but i don't believe this president can i think we need a president was the credibility to bring the allies back to the table and to do what's necessary

to make it so america isn't doing this alone come back to reckon with a lot of comeback world began on homeland security this is a two minute no question senator kerry as president what would you do specifically in addition to or differently to increase the homeland security in the united states and what president bush devoted to do and they're a long list of things first of all what kind of mixed message does it send when you've got five hundred billion dollars going over director put police officers in the streets of iraq and the president is cutting the cops program in america what got a message does it send the senate might open fire houses in iraq that were shouting fire houses for the first responders here in america the president hasn't put one but not one metal into the effort to fix some of our tunnels bridges and most expose subway systems at why they had to close down subway in new york when the republican convention was there when done the work that ought to be done the president ninety five percent of the containers that come into the ports

where deer in florida are not inspected civilians get on the aircraft in their mortgages x ray of the cargo hold is not actually as i make you feel safer america there's president thought was more board to give the wealthiest people in america tax cut rather than invest in homeland security those aren't my parents i believe in protecting america first and long before president bush and i get a text that that's who gets juan before we do i'm going to invest in homeland security and almond make sure when i coming cuts programs america and we're fully staffed in our fire hoses and that we protect the nuclear chemical plants the president also unfortunately gave into the chemical industry which didn't want to do some of things necessary to strengthen our chemical plant explosion and there's an enormous ongoing job to protect the loose nuclear materials in the world that are able to get terrorists that's a whole other subject but i say we still are more time and just quickly say at the current pace the president will not

secure loose material and so the former soviet union thirteen years on them to do it for years and i keep it out of the hands of terrorists by second was last april he promises is it's like a huge tax gap and that for another debate my administration has tripled in the money we're spending on homeland security to thirty billion dollars a year i'm an education work with cars form of homeland security so we could better quarter borders and forty thousand actually worked on the southern border more thousand on the northern border or modernizing our borders we spent three point one billion dollars for foreign police three point one billion dollars that were done our duty to provide the funding but the best way to protect his homeland as a state on the assets you know we have to be part of upper right of one percent a tiny

indiana neon is the wry wants terrorists as a lot of people working hard and byway we've also change the culture of the fbi too counterterrorism is his number one priority for communicating better lawyer former intelligence services to make sure that we get the best intelligence fossil the patriot act is vital it's vital that the congress to renew the patriot act which enables our law enforcement to disrupt terror cells but again i repeat to my fellow citizens the best way to protect his daily outfits aig's that's a dollar gets just thirty seconds presenter said the fbi changed its culture we just read on the front pages of america's paper is that there are over a hundred thousand hours of tapes and listen in on one of those tapes maybe the enemy being right the next time and the test is not whether you're spending more money the testes are you doing everything

possible to make america safe we didn't need that tax that america needed to be safe for sugar and everything we can protect americans that i wake up every day thinking about how best to protect america that's my job i work with a director or more of the fbi comes in my office when i'm in washington every morning talk about how to protect this is also really good people working hard to do so it's hard work but i didn't want to tell the american people were doing everything we can on which you better have a president who changes he stares down and bring to justice before they were to see again no question now must the president to midas what criteria would you use to determine when to start bringing us troops home from there let me first tell you that the best way to direct the safest cure for iraqi citizens to be trained to do the

job unless you were going to get a hundred thousand train album twenty five thousand by the end of this year the two hundred thousand by the intonation that is the best way would never succeed records iraqi citizens do not want a man are known is to protect themselves up believe they want to prime minister while we believe they want to and so the best indication about when we can bring our troops on which i really want to do but i don't want to be so for the sake of real mama wonders so because we've achieved an objective is this is the seed iraqis reform is to see the iraqis step up and take responsibility so there's your question is what our generals on the ground ambassador negroponte tells me that iraq is really good thing or so from these terrorists the lessons of that will win in helmand and that their stability and that they're on their way to unite the nation of that story that's when about that as soon as possible but i know putting artificial deadlines will work them up on a

one time say well it may lead lawyer mather six months that's we can't do that and expect to win the war on terror my message to our troops it's like a tortured beyond were standing with a strong will give you all the equipment she made i will get your momma says the measures because this is a vital mission the free rat will be an ally in the water and that's essentially a free iraq will send a powerful example of the park a world that is desperate for freedom a free rat will help secure israel the free rat will enforce the hopes and aspirations of the reformers in places like iran or free rat is essential for the security of this country they're not a second senator karen thank you jim my message to the troops is also thank you for what they're doing but it's also help is on the way i believe those troops deserve better than what they are getting to know it's interesting when i was in the rope line just the other day come out here from wisconsin a couple of the young are attorneys were in the

line one active duty one from the guard and they both look today and said we need you to help us over there i believe there's a better way to do this you know the president's father did not going to iraq in the baghdad beyond gaza and the reason he didn't as he said you wrote this book because there was no viable exit strategy and he said our troops would be occupiers in a bitterly hostile land that's exactly where we find ourselves today there's a sense of american occupation the only building that was guarded when the troops went into baghdad was the oil ministry we didn't guard the nuclear facilities we didn't guard foreign office where you might have found information about weapons of mass destruction we didn't guard the borders almost every step of the way our troops and left and he's starting early difficult missions i know is like to go out on one those missions we don't know what's around the corner and i believe our troops need other allies helping it to hold that

summit i will bring fresh credibility a new start and we will get the job done right oh my god we can have thirty seconds here i nap on that says help was on the way but with the messes at your troops in harm's way or wrong place wrong time some message commander chief gives readers a great diversion as well help is on the way to a certain cartel in twenty voted against eighty seven billion dollars supplemental to provide equipment for troops in a city actually get go forward for a vote against it so what the men are just because when you're trying to lead troops characters and well you know i talked about the use of the dollars i made a mistake and how i talk about the war that the president made a mistake it invaded iraq which was worse by police

when you know something's going wrong you make it right that's what i learned in vietnam when i came back from the war i saw that was wrought some people don't like the fact that i stood up to say no but i did and that's what i did with that boat and on the league those troops to victory i do question to whether senator kerry speaking of vietnam you spoke to congress in nineteen seventy one that you came back from vietnam and you said quote at us command to be the last man to die for a mistake are americans now dying in iraq for a must say you know when they don't have to providing we have the leadership that we put an offer i believe that we would have to in this prison i was agreed on that and from the beginning i did vote to give the authority because i thought saddam hussein was a threat and i don't accept that that intelligence but i also laid out a very strict series of things we needed to do in order to perceive from the position of strength and the president in fact

promised them you went to cincinnati and he gave a speech in which he said we will plan carefully we will proceed cautiously we will not make war inevitable we will go with our allies you know i have those things that into the planning their lack of planning at the state department in the state department tests they avoid it even the advice of their own gentle generous tshisekedi the army chief of staff said your needs of a hundred thousand votes instead of listening to him to retire the terrorism czar who has worked for every president since ronald reagan said invading a rapid response to nine eleven would be like franklin roosevelt invaded mexico in response to pearl harbor that's what we have here what we need now is a president who understands how to bring these other countries together to recognize their stakes in this they do have stakes in it the boy said states of the arab countries of the state to not having civil

war the european countries have a stake in not having total disorder on their doorstep but this president has even held a kind of a statesman like summits that pull people together and get them to invest in those states in fact he's done the opposite he pushed them away when the secretary general coffee and offered the united nations he said no no we'll do this alone to say how important the spoils of war they actually issued a memorandum from the defense department saying if you were with us in the war don't bother applying for a construction as the way to invite people friends as totally absurd of course the un was invited in and we support the un efforts are people that over sergio de mello get killed but they're now back in helping with elections are bonuses didn't have any allies is warm witty say to tony blair was he said that alexander process people and you can expect an alliance we denigrate the contributions of those who are serving

side by side with american troops in iraq plus he says a cornerstone of his plan to succeed iraqis to call upon nations to serve so what's the message going to be please join us in a record for grand diversion join us for a war that is a wrong or the wrong place at the wrong time i don't how these people think i do it all the time i sit down with the world leaders frequently until up to him on the phone for me they're not gonna follow somebody says as the wrong war at the wrong place at the wrong time or not to follow somebody whose core convictions the changing views of politics in america and finally says we are at a summit with our summit's being held japan is going to have a summit for the donor's forty billion dollars pledge and prime minister presume is conoco countries to account to get him to contribute and has been a matter of some of the neighboring countries

and cornell have set help set up this summer thirty seconds is the united nations for help and we never get them up on that and it was necessary to transfer authority and transfer reconstruction was always american rock secondly when we went and there were three countries great britain australia in united states thats not a grand coalition we can do better thirty seconds let's say for the poem and others thirty nations involved sitting side by side with her american troops in honor of their sacrifices and i don't appreciate when a candidate for president and a great the contributions of the brave brave soldier's institute you can't lead the world if you ought to not a lot of the contributions of those workers he called the coal worst in the bride as that it bring people together our coalition has strong to remain strong for my songs and the presenter nick new question mr president two months you have said there

was a quote miscalculation of what the conditions would be imposed for iraqis what was the miscalculation and how do i know what i said was there because we achieve such a rapid victory moreover saddam loyalists we're around and we thought we'd where moore and the one in the biggest army phrases such a great job in planning operations we move rapidly and a lot of the memphis and saddam loyalists lay down their arms disappeared i thought we would go they would stay and fight but they didn't know were fine and now so it's hard work dan martinez i get the casualty reports every day i see on the tv screens how hard it is what is necessary work and

i'm optimistic see i think you can be realistic and optimistic at the same time i'm optimistic we'll cheat i know we won't achieve if we sent mixed signals i know we're not going to achieve our objectives if we send mixed signals to our troops our friends the iraqi citizens but the plan plays the places of elections in january there will be places will train iraqi soldiers so they can do the hard work and we are easily just america but nato is now helping jordan's helping train police uae is helping train police without eighty seven billion dollars over the next monster reconstruction efforts they were making progress there and our lives are strong very distorted has to be a summit of the arab nations japan will be hosting a summit were making progress it is hard work it is hard work to go from the tyranny fear democracy is hard work to go from a place where people get their

hands cut off or executed who plays for the periphery but is necessary work and for iraqis to make this world a more peaceful place and a sense of terror what it troubles a lot of people in our country is the president as just so describe one kind of the state bar what he has said is that even knowing there were no weapons of mass destruction even knowing there was no imminent threat even knowing there was no connection of outsider he would still have done everything the same way those are his words no i would not so what i'm trying to do is just talk the truth to the american people into the world the truth is what good policy is based on its what leadership is based on the president says that on denigrating these troops are iran nothing but respect for the british point where what they were willing to do that you can't tell me that when the most troops any other country has on the ground is great britain with a thousand three hundred and below

that the four others are below four thousand and below that there isn't anybody out of the hundreds that we have a genuine coalition to get this job done you can't tell me that on the day that we went into that war and it started it was principally the united states the american great britain and wanted to others that's it and today we are ninety percent of the casualties in ninety percent of the costs and meanwhile north korea has got nuclear weapons talk about mixed messages the president as the ones that we can allow countries get nuclear weapons they have all changed that no question senator kerry two minutes so you just read you repeatedly accused president bush won here tonight but elsewhere were for not telling the truth about iraq essentially of lying to the american people about contracts give us some examples of what you consider debate is not telling the truth was never never used the harshest words you do just that i try not to

but nevertheless tell you that i think he has not been candid with the american people to exactly how first of all we all know that in a stately union message until congress about nuclear materials that didn't exist we know that he promised america that he was going to build this coalition i just described the coalition is not the kind of coalition we were described we were talking about voting for this the president said he would exhaust the remedies of the united nation and go through that whole process he didn't he cut it off sort of arbitrarily and we know that there were further diplomatic center efforts underway they just decided the time for diplomacy is over and rush to war without planning for what happens afterwards now he misled the american people in a speech when he said we will planned carefully they obviously didn't he misled the american people when he said that we go to war is a last resort we did not go as a last resort and most americans know the difference now this has cost us

deeply in the world i believe that it is important to tell the truth the american people i worked with those leaders the president talks about work with him for twenty years for longer than this president and i know what many of them say it and i know how to bring him back to the table and i believe that fresh start new credibility a president who understands what we have to do to reach out to the muslim world to make it clear that this is not you know osama bin laden uses the invasion of arrived in order to go out to people and say that america has declared war on islam we need to be smarter about how we wage a war on terror we need to deny them the recruits we need to deny them a safe havens we need to rebuild our alliances i believe that ronald reagan and john kennedy others do that more effectively and i'm a try to follow in their footsteps i saw this as something amazing said some of the un uses invasion iraqi as issues of spread agent for market summit london to determine that we defend

ourselves some of the london that we get to decide the american people decide i decided the right action was an anorak apple recalls a mistake it was a mistake he said oh ms leverett i don't think he was misleading when he called a rack a grave threat the fall of two thousand two he was misleading when he said that it was right to disarm iraq in the spring of two thousand three medium is legit when he said that you know a few people have doubted whether the world over that saddam was a power it didn't have the judgment to present i don't think he was misleading i think what is misleading is to say you can lead and succeed interact if you keep changing your positions on this already has as a politics changes positions change and that's that our commander in chief x after we finished the intelligence i looked at was the same intelligence

michael looked at some very same intelligence when i sit up there spoke to the cars i was taken off the same intelligence he looked at the make his decision to support the authorization of force i have thirty seconds thirty seconds here and i wasn't misleading when i said it was a threat nor was i misleading on the day that the president decided to go to war when i said that he had made a mistake or not building strong alliances and that i would have preferred that you get more diplomacy either one position one consistent position that saddam hussein was a threat that was a right way to disarm him and a wrong way and the president chose the wrong way there is no i think this is about money opponents' position is that he's been inconsistent he changes positions and you cannot change positions in this war on terror age expect to win and i expect a win is necessary we when we're being challenged

like never before and we have a duty to our country and to future generations of america to achieve a freer rack a free afghanistan and rid the world of weapons of mass destruction new question mr president two months has the war in iraq than worth the cost in american lives ten thousand and fifteen twenty one thousand fifty two as a day for every life is precious every life matters you know my hardest the hardest for the job is to know that i commit the troops in harm's way and then do the best i can to provide comfort for the loved ones who lost a son or daughter a husband wife and not think about mrs johnson's a fantasy family i met in charlotte north carolina cher son brian they came to see me her husband pj got killed in afghanistan were directors nuts are more

attractive for the lovers best they can knowing full well that the decision i made cause for her glow going to be in harm's way october after week braden clear that authorities to sacrifice was noble unworthy because i understand the stakes in this war on terror i understand that we must find out that wherever they had we must deal with threats before they fully materialize and saddam hussein was a threat and that we must read liberty because in the long run the way to defeat hatred in tyranny and oppression is spread freedom ms he understood that this was cheat on her husband understood

caesar was awarded wharton but every life is precious it's what distinguishes us from the enemy everybody matters but i think it's worth it to him i think it's worth it because i think they know in the long term aid for iraqi free afghanistan was set such a powerful example of parma world is just the freedom that will help change the world that we can look back and say we did our duty center ninety seconds i understand what the president's talking about because i know it means to lose people in combat and the question is worth the cost reminds me of my own thinking when i came back from fighting in that war and it reminds me that it is vital for us not to confuse the war ever with the warriors that happened before and that's one of the reasons why i believe i get this job done

because i am determined for those soldiers and for those families for those kids who put their lives on the line that is noble that's the most noble thing that anybody can do and i want to make sure the outcome honors that ability now we have a choice here i've laid out a plan by which i think we can be successful in iraq with a solemn by doing better training first by cutting by by doing what we need to do with respect to the un and the elections or twenty five percent of people in there they can an election right now the president's not getting the job done so the choice for a market is you get have a plan that i laid out and four points each of which i can tell you more about argo john kerry dot com and see more of that we have the president's plan which is for words more of the same it my plan is better and my plan is better chance of standing up and fighting for those

troops i will never let those troops down and we'll kill the terrorists wherever they are you know great article thirty seconds yeah i understand on a measly the commander chief if i were ever say this is the long war the wrong time at the right place the chives and wonder how can i find this guy you cannot lead the war on terror if you keep changing positions on water and says things like well this is just a grand diversion is not a grand averse and this is an essential that we get it right inside the plant he talks about simply won't work cemetery new thirty second yet there is a threat that the secretary of state colin powell told those present pottery barn rule if you break it effects now the breakout you made a mistake it's a wrong thing to do

but yonan and then you got a fix it do some know that's what we have to do there's no inconsistency soldiers no over there that this isn't be undone right yep i'm going to get it right for those soldiers cause it's important to israel it's important to american support of the world to border the fight on terror but i have a plan to do if he does begin at your plant in question senator kerry two minutes then you give us specifics terms of a scenario time the timelines and seller of four in the us a major us military involvement in iraq the timeline that i've set out and again i want to direct the president because he's misled again shaving what i said i didn't say i would bring troops out in six months i said if we do the things that i set out and we are successful we could bring him to draw the troops down in six months and i think a critical component of success in a rack is being able to convince the iraqis

in the arab world that the united states does in that long term designs on as i understand it were building some forty military bases there now and some people say that rather permanent concept when you when you guard the oil ministry digital guard the nuclear facilities a message to a lot of people is may be well maybe their interest in our oil now the problem is that they didn't think these things through properly and these are the things you have to think through what i want to do is change the dynamics on the ground and yet to do that by beginning to not back off what looters and other places and send the wrong message to the terrorists you have to close the borders you've got to show he's serious in that regard but you've also got to show that you're prepared to bring the rest of the world in and share the stakes i will make a flat statement the united states of america has no long term designs and staying interact and our goal in my administration would be to get all the troops out there with a minimal amount you need for training and logistics as we do in some other countries in the

world after or to be alone sustain that piece about that's how we're going to win the peace by rapidly training the iraqis themselves you know the administration has admitted they haven't done the training because they came back to congress a few weeks ago and asked for a completely programming of the money but what greater admission is their sixteen months afterwards also hadn't done the job we gotta start to spend the money now we'll guys give us permission to shift it over into training nice hundred thousand troops train police guard special units border patrol that i'm a hundred twenty five thousand train but in this year you'll get the job done sort or rib eye nose hard work because of the german enemy is trying to defeat is now the promises he's going to try to change the dynamics on the ground well prime minister ali was here he is the leader of that country has a brave brave man when he came after giving a speech that

congress map on to question his credibility can change the dynamics on the ground if you've criticized the brave leader of a rack one of his campaign people as the primary so i was just like a puppet it's no way to treat somebody who's courageous and brave that has tried to lead his country forward the way to make sure that we had succeeded it's the same consistent sound messages to the iraqi people that when we give our work we will keep our word that we stand with you that we believe you want to be free and i do i believe that there are twenty five million people the vast majority long been long have elections i reject this notion on the suggestion that bonuses and i reject the notion that some say that if your muslim you can't be for you don't deserve freedom i

disagree strongly disagree with that thirty seconds i mean i couldn't agree more that iraqis one of the free and that they could be free but i think the president again still isn't shown i was going to go about it the right way is more the same now prime us for allowing came here and he said the terrorists are pouring over the borders that allow his assessment the national intelligence assessment that was given to the president's allies said best case scenario more of the same of what we see today worst case scenario so or i could do better in the late yesterday sent the reason why prime minister a while we said they come across the border is busy ranking isis that this is a central part of the war on terror they're fighting is because they're fighting freedom they understand that a free afghanistan or free or act will be a major defeat for them and those are the stakes and that's why it is essential we not leave the slices as we hold the line that's why says a

when and we will under my leadership we're going to win this war interact as residue question two minutes does the iraqi experience make it more likely or less likely that you would take the united states into another preemptive military action i would hope i never have to understand our it is to commit troops never want to commit troops never for our group ltd regen two thousand never dreamt to be doing that but the enemy attack is jim and i have a solemn duty to protect the american people to do everything i can to protect us i think that by speaking clearly and doing what we say and not sending mixed messages it is less like will honor these troops would a president must always be willing to use troops amassed as a last resort the air was hopeful diplomacy at work interact it was falling apart there was

no doubt in my mind that saddam hussein was hoping that the world would turn a blind eye if you didn't know is that left leg is burger's work or less the hope to talking that maybe if at that resolution would work you'd be stronger and tougher and a lot more sources no doubt in my mind lulu the day saddam hussein been in power so we use diplomacy every chance we get bullied me i will never have to use force but by speaking clearly and sending messages that we mean what we say with affected the warm applause and would look at libya libya was a threat libya's now peacefully dismantling its weapons programs cheney libby understood that america and others i will enforce doctrine end of the world is better for some as your question would hope we never have to i think by acting formally decisively in maine was less

likely less likely we have to use force secretary ninety seconds turned the president asserts something extraordinarily revealing and i'm frankly a very important in this debate in answering your question about iraq and sending people into ride he just said the enemy attack this summer's end in attendance of some of the law intact this outcry that attacked the us and when we have osama bin ladin cornered in the mountains of tora bora one thousand of his cohorts with animals mounts with american military forces nearby and in the field we didn't use the best trained troops in the world to go kill world's number one criminal on terrace they outsourced the job to afghan warlords who only a week earlier been on the other side fighting against us neither of whom trusted each other that's the enemy that attacked us that's the enemy that was allowed to walk out of those mountains that's the enemy that is now sixty countries

with stronger recruits he also since i was a little bit stronger that is just factually incorrect two thirds of the country was a no fly zone when we started this war we would oppose sanctions we would have the un inspectors saw was a boy i've been continually weakening if the president had shown the patients to go through another round of resolution to sit down with those leaders say what you mean what we need now how much more would take to get you to join us we'd be in a stronger place today for christmas of course an osama bin laden at that i know that and secondly they think that another router resolutions would've kassebaum the same to disarm disclose this is ludicrous and a jazz musician is it's significant difference of opinion we drive the policy we did our best he was hoping to turn a blind eye and yes he would've been stronger when i met with him yet the

capability making weapons and he would've made weapons thirty seconds thirty five to forty countries in the world at a greater capability of making weapons at the moment the president invaded and so on the city and while he's been diverted with nine out of ten active duty divisions of our army either going to rack coming back from a rapper or get ready to go north korea's got nuclear weapons and the world is more dangerous iran is moving towards a nuclear weapons and the world is more dangerous dark for as a genocide the world is more dangerous it may be better to its request in two minutes either carry what is your position on the whole concept of pre emptive war president always has the right always has had the right for preemptive strike and that was a great doctrine throughout the cold war and it was always one the things we argued about with respect arms control i know president through all of american history has ever seated and

nor would i write to preempt in anyway necessary to protect the united states of america but if and when you do and jim you've got to do it in a way that passes the protest that passes the global test where your countrymen your people understand fully why you're doing what you're doing and you can prove to the world that you did it for legitimate reasons here we have our own secretary of state has had to apologize to the world for the presentation they made to the united nations and a wig and remember when president kennedy in the cuban missile crisis sent his secretary of state to paris to meet with the goal at an animal of the discussion to tell them about the missiles in two ways said iran issue of photos and people waved him off and said no no no the word of the present the united states is good enough for me how many leaders in the world today would respond to us as a result of what we've done in that way so what is a test here is the credibility of the united states of america and how we lead the world

iran and rapid now i'm ordained at iran and north korea are now more dangerous now whether preemption is ultimately when asked outright i don't know yet but i'll tell you this is president palmer take my eye off the ball i've been fighting for proliferation the entire diet i proliferation entire time i've been to congress and we watch this president actually turn away from some of the treaties that were on the table you know help yourself with other nations when you turn away from the global warming treaty for instance or when you refuse to deal with like the united nations have to earn that respect and i think that we have a lot of earning back to do it a second video i'm not exactly sure we meet passes the global test to take preemptive action to pass a global test my attitude is to take preemptive action and worked at the american people to act in order to make his country secure la porte talks

about me not signing certain treaties repay one thing out to the sign and i think it shows the difference in her opinion the difference of opinions and it is not i wouldn't join international mr courtney somebody based in the hague where an accountable judges and prosecutors to pull our troops are diplomats up for trial and i would join an honest and uncertain capitals of around the world that want a popular movie but it's the right move not to join a forecourt that kid where people could be prosecuted my opponent he is for joining the international criminal court at i just think trying to be popular in the global sense if it's not our visitors' makes no sense i'm interested

in working with the nations and do a lot of it but i'm not gonna make decisions that i think are wrong for america no question do you believe that diplomacy and sanctions can resolve the nuclear problems with north korea an air and taken them in any order you would like a north korea first i do they say a certain hope so before i was born in the policy discovered was that bilateral negotiations with north korea and we saw an agreement north korea than my administration say that the job was not done being honored by the north koreans and so i decided that a better way to approach the issue was to get other nations involved justices are less in corporate taxes agreed that a nuclear weapons free north of premature korean peninsula was in his interest in our interest in the

world's interests and so we began a new dialogue with north korea one that include millionaires has been that china and china's got a lot of influence over north korea some ways more than we do as well we included us south korea japan and russia say another five voices speaking to kim jong il not just one answer ginger ale the sides again to not our agreement is not only doing injustice to america be doing injustice to china as well and i think it's a work is not to work we open up a dialogue with kim jong il as woody once he was to unravel the six party talks or the five five nation coalition that sending him a clear message on iran i hope we do the same thing continue to work with the world to convince the iranian last to abandon their nuclear ambitions we work very closely with the foreign ministers of france germany and great

britain who have been delivering the message to them was that if you expect to be part of them world nations get ready your major programs the iaea is involved there's a special protocol recently been passed allows for instance but as i hope we can do it and we got a good strategy since iowa carry out it sense with respect around the british french and germans were the ones who initiated effort without the united states' regrettably to begin to draw to move to tour the nuclear the possibilities in iran i believe we could have done better i think the united states should have offered at the opportunity to provide nuclear fuel test them to see whether or not they were actually looking for it for peaceful purposes if they weren't willing to work a deal that we could have put sanctions together the president did nothing with respect to north korea the real story we have inspectors and television cameras in the nuclear reactor in north korea sector build during negotiations

and we knew where the fuel rods and we knew the limits on their nuclear power champa are sectors state announced one day that we would continue the dialogue work with the north koreans president reversed them publicly while the president of south korea was here the presence of career went back to dress up or bewildered am embarrassed because it went against his policy and for two years this administration didn't talk at all to north korea while they didn't talk at all the fuel rods came out the inspectors were kicked out the television cameras were kicked out and today there were forty seven nuclear weapons in the hands of north korea that happened on this president's watch now that i think is where most serious so reversals of our mixed messages that you could possibly say i think europeans are weighted in this one night i will make sure that we understand that people people want to understand the differences between the two of you on this you want to continue the multinational

talks direct anyone here want to do it i want while our own thoughts and put all the issues from the armistice of nineteen fifty two the economic issues the human rights issues the artillery disposal issues the dnc issues and the nuclear issues on the table and your poster that arrived in the minute we have bilateral talks the six party talks online exactly what kim job kim jong il wants and by the way the brakes on the agreement was not the plutonium that reason it really is highly enriched uranium as we can and doing the story is breaking the agreement in the us suddenly said the city where you were to put sanctions on iran which are essentially random yes i'm sure many more there are sanctions placed on iran and finally we were particularly convincing that the working with a germany france and great britain the center for measures into law and a question to most us senator kerry mentioned are for the dar

for region of sudan fifty thousand people have already died in an area more than they are homeless it's been labeled an active ongoing genocide yet neither one of you or anyone else connected with your campaign for your administration that i can find as discussed the possibility of sending in troops well i'll tell you exactly why not the first one as i said that the sanctions on iran only the united states but the sanctions on alone and that's exactly what i'm talking about in order for the sanctions to be effective we should've and working with british french and germans other countries and that's the difference in the present day and there again he sort of slid by the question now with a respected are four yeses a genocide and months ago many of us were pressing for action i think the reason that we're not saying send american troops at this point a soulful number one we can do this through the african union providing we give them the logistical support right now all the president is providing his humanitarian support we

need to do more than that they've got to have the logistical capacity to go in and stop the killing and that's going to require more than is on the table today also believe that it is the one that raises we can't do it as were overextended ask of the people in the armed forces today we got cards and reserves were doing double duties we got a backdoor draft taking place in america today people would stop loss programs where they're told you can't get out the military nine out of our ten active duty divisions committed to iraq one way or the other either going coming are preparing so this is the way the president is over extended the united states that's why in my plan i had to active duty divisions to the united states army not far right but for our general demands across the board i also intend to double the number of special forces so that we can do the job we need to do with respect to fighting the terrorists around the world and if we do that then we have the ability to be able to respond more rapid but i'll tell you this is president if the american forces to some

degree to coalesce the african union i'd be prepared to do it because we could never allow another rwanda it's a more responsibility for us in the world it sat back to a renter for second it was not my administration to put the sanctions on iran that happened long before ryan washington dc in terms of the fort bragg race genocide and colin powell so state we committed to a million dollars worth of aid with a leading dawn world health the suffering people there or we will commit more overtime to help were very much involved in the un on the sanctions policy of the bashir government in the sudan carted off four ambassador jagged and forth in the negotiating yourself agreement that we would hope we brought

peace to the savannas i agree with my opponent that we shouldn't be committing troops there will be working with the african union to be so precisely what we did in liberia has helped stabilize situation with some troops and when the african union came we move them out my hope is that the african union move rapidly to help save lives and forcefully the rainy season will be ending shortly which will make it easier to get aid there and help the long suffering people there newell no question president bush are clearly as we work major policy differences between the two of you are there also underline character issues that you will lead make you believe are serious enough to deny sen kerry the job as commander in chief of the united states it's a loaded question

surgeries services are country and mire of the second is a great dad pre shift the fact that his daughters had been so kind of my daughter's in and there would have been a pretty arch bridge for english young girls standard is out there campaigning he served for twenty years in the senate on the security or the record well i guess in that he went to yale my concerns about the senator is that in the course of this campaign have been listening very carefully what he says any changes positions on the warner archives change positions on something as fundamental as what you believe in your car your heart says his right foot iran it can

only if you sell maxim is mixed messages mixed messages several singles tour troops mixed messages in the wrong signals to our allies mixed messages send the wrong signal to the iraqis citizens and that's my biggest concern about my opponent mara service but i am i just know how this world works and in the councils of government there must be certainly from the us president course we changed tactics we need to but we never changed our beliefs the strategic belief that are necessary to protect this country in the world and it's a response well first of all why i appreciate enormously on the bristol campus just made an ally share them with a big only if you if you're doing this and he's done it what i

have in terms of president say i can you begin to get a sense of what it means that your families i have a staff and so i acknowledge his daughters of watch film chuckled a few times some economists and awe and i might have great respect admiration for his wife and i think she's a terrific great first lady but we do have differences and knock and talk about different set of character i don't think that's my job or my business but let me talk about something that the president to sort of finish with maybe someone would call it the character trait that somebody would but this issue of certainty it's one thing to be certain which you can be certain and iraq it's another to be certain and the right would be certainly moving in the right

direction to be certain about a principle and then learn new facts and take those new facts and put them to use in order to change that policy right what i worry about with the president is that he's not acknowledging what's on the ground is not acknowledging the realities of north korea's not acknowledging the truth of the science a stem cell researcher of global warming and other issues and certainly sometimes can get in trouble well i think it was and i fully agree that that one should shift tactics and we will iraqis are commanders and all the flexibility to do is necessary to succeed but what i won't do is change my core values because of politics because of pressure and it is it's one of things i'm learning the white house is that there's enormous pressure on the president he cannot wilt under that pressure that was the world will be better off i had no intention of

welding and never will that in my life and i've never wavered in my life i know exactly what we need to do interact and my position has been consistent saddam hussein as a threat he needed to be disarmed we needed to go the un the president needed the authority to use force in order to be only get him to do something cause he never did it without threat of force but we didn't need to rush to war without a plan to win the peace no question two minute sen kerry if you are elected president what will you take to that all this thinking is the single most serious threat to the national security of the united states nuclear proliferation nuclear proliferation there's some six hundred plus tons of unsecured material still in the former soviet union russia at the rate that the president is currently securing that it'll take thirteen years to get it i did a lot of work and loesser wrote a book about it several years ago they said seven years ago called the new

war which saw the difficulties of this international criminal network and back then we intercepted a suitcase in a middle eastern country with nuclear materials and at the black market sale price was about two hundred fifty million dollars now there are terrorist trying to get their hands on that stuff today and this president i regret to say as secured less nuclear material in the last two years since nine eleven than we did in the two years preceding nine eleven we have to do this job and to do the job you can cut the money for president actually cut the money for you have to put the money into it and the funding in the leadership and part of that leadership is sending the right message to places like north korea right now the president is spending hundreds of millions of dollars to research bunker busting nuclear weapons united states is pursuing a new set of nuclear weapons doesn't make sense you talk about mixed messages were telling other people you can't have nuclear

weapons but were pursuing a nuclear weapon that we might even contemplate using not this president on a shot that program down and we're gonna make it clear to the world we're serious about containing nuclear proliferation and we're going to get the job containing all that nuclear material in russia are done in four years and we're going to build the strongest international network to prevent nuclear proliferator should it this is this is the scale of what president kennedy set out to do with the nuclear test ban treaty it's our generation's of global and i tend to get at the concept that actually increase funding for a forum dealing with nuclear proliferation about thirty five percent seven the president certainly weeks so it was called the grey with that my opponent that the biggest threat facing this country is the weapons of mass destruction the hands of a terrorist network and that's why we've put proliferation

is that when the centerpieces of a mortar prong strategy to make the country safer my ministry sister was called proliferation security initiative over sixty nations involved with disrupting the trans shipment of information and or weapons the message materials and were in effect if we are biased to the aq khan network says the proliferator out of pakistan that was selling secrets to places like north korea and libya we convince libya to disarm successful part of dealing with weapons of mass destruction proliferation and other way to help protect american alarmist long run is to continue with missile defenses and we got a robust research development program that's been ongoing during my administration will be implementing a missile defense system relatively quickly and that is

another way to help deal with the threats that we face in the twenty for such a melbourne i suppose the missile defense is just for this one minute discussion here is it's just for whatever seconds it takes so it's it's correct to say that someone is listening to this will think you're great if you're re elected president and if you are reading you are likely the single most serious threat you believe all the new billy is nuclear proliferation it in the hands of a person weapons of mass destruction nuclear proliferation but again the test of the difference between us presidents at four years to try to do something about it and north korea has got more weapons around is moving towards weapons and at his place it'll take thirteen years to secure those weapons and russia i'm on the do in four years and ahmed immediately set out a bilateral talks with north korea again i kick it j m a big mistake that is to have bilateral talks with north korea's precisely what

congenial wants it'll cost six party talks to evaporate elisa channel lawyers involved convincing along with us from kim jong il to get rid of his weapons it's a big mistake to do that we must have chinas leverage on kim jong il besides ourselves and at our bilateral talks that we had to walk away from the table and over their work it was president this is this is the last question and the two men inside solution is simply dead new question has to do with president putin and russia did you misjudged omar are you do you feel that what he is doing in the name of anti terrorism by changes in democratic processes is ok no i don't think it's ok said so publicly i think that there is the checks and balances in a democracy and made it very clear that by consolidating power in

the central government now he's sending a signal to the worst immoral in nine states that they perhaps he doesn't believe in checks and balances and i thought in that he's also strong ally in order is as they went through a horrible situation and those long were these terrorists gun down the un school kids the summation the enemy though its way we need to be firm and resolve and bringing them justice says the woodland linnet understands as well in relation with latimer and it's important we get to the real issue because it enables me to better comment to him and better to discuss with him some of the decisions he'd made a fan in this world that there that it's important established to pursue a relationship with people so that when you had disagreements you're able to disagree in a way that is effective as the toll in my opinion california's doesn't it more

with him as time goes on russia's russia's a country in transition farmers have to make some hard choices and i think it's very important for the american president as well as other western leaders remind him of the great benefits of democracy that democracy you know will that help people realize their hopes and aspirations and dreams and i will continue working with him over the next four years i set the center very well learned to say correctly that i had an extraordinary experience of watching a close and personal that transition in russia because i was there right after the transformation us problem for senators one senator bob smith of new hampshire formed center go down into the kgb underneath tripling the square and see rhames of files with names and the man i so broad homework transition to democracy that russia was trying to make my regret what happened in these past ten

months and i think it goes beyond just the response to her but this group now controls all television stations as political opposition is being put in jail and i think it's very important for the united states obviously they have a working relationship that as good as a very important country gets we want a partnership but we always have to stand up for democracy as george will said the other day freedom on the march not in russia right now not like to come back for a quick moment i can to that issue about china and the torso that says that's where most critical issues here north korea just because the president says it can't be done which includes china doesn't mean it can't be done and as the president said there were weapons of mass destruction said mission accomplished civic it's like the war intrigue none of which were true we get a bilateral talks with kim jong il and we get those weapons at the same time as we get china because china has an interest in the outcome too in the thirty second spot you know

my opinion north korea collapsing water use the word troops again or make it talk about the truth of the matter your store truth again that that raise any hackles a jew but you are pretty compact don't take it personally we'd be looked at the same intelligence game the same conclusion the saddam hussein was a grave threat and somebody said great threat i'm not consciously and tell the truth we look at the same intel decided it was best not the issue the issue is what to do about it the president said he was going to build a true coalition exhaust the remedies of the un and go towards a last resort those words really have to mean something and unfortunately he didn't go towards a last resort now we have this incredible mess around two hundred billion dollars

it's it's it's it's not what the american people thought they were getting when they built it that brings us to closing statement stand as it again as determined by a coin toss senator kerry go first and you have two minutes thank you john very much thank you very much to be embarrassed again thank you mr president my fellow americans as i said at the very beginning of this debate both president bush and i love this country very much there's no doubt i think about but we have a different set of convictions about how we make our country stronger your home and respected again in the world i know that for many view saying that all parents of kids interact you wanna know who's the person could be a commander in chief would get tickets all we get the job done and when the peace and for all the rest of the parents in america are wondering about their kids going to school or anywhere else in the world what kind of world are going to grow up in let me look you in the eye and say gee

i defended this country as a young man and more and i will defend it as president of the united states but i have a difference with this president i believe were strongest when we reach out and leave the world and build strong alliances i have a plan for a rack i believe we can be successful are not talking about lately talking about winning and we need a fresh start a new credibility of president would bring allies to our side i also have a plan to win the war on terror funding homeland security strengthening our military cutting off finances reaching out to the world again building strong alliances i believe america's best days are ahead of us because i believe that the future belongs to freedom not to fear that's the country that i'm going to fight for and i ask you to give me the opportunity to make you proud i asked him of the opportunity to lead this great nation so that we can be stronger here a whole

respected again in the world and have responsible leadership that we deserve it and god bless america is president of the center for mark has chosen certain a weakness in this decade the world record tragedy as not to happen so long as i'm the president the next four years will continue to strengthen our homeland defense this will strengthen our intelligence gathering services reform military military will be an all volunteer army we will continue to stay on the offsets will fight the terrorists around the world so we do not have to face in her home we continue to build our alliances i'll never turn over america's national security needs to leaders of other countries as we continue to build those alliances will continue to spread freedom i believe in the transformational power of liberty i believe that the four iraqis in

this nation's interests probably the free afghanistan is in the state assembly where the free afghanistan for iraq will serve as a powerful example for millions who pleaded in silence for liberty in the broader middle east with our work together over the last three and a half years we've been challenged and would resist those challenges we've climbed the money not massive valley below it's a valley of peace but being steadfast and resolute and strong by keeping our work as supporting our troops we can achieve the peace we all want i appreciate your listening tonight i ask for your vote and may god continue to bless our great land and that im still night's debate a reminder of the second presidential debate will be a

week from tomorrow october eighth from washington university in st louis charles gibson of abc news will moderate a town hall type of them then on october thirteen from arizona state university in tempe bob schieffer of cbs is will moderate an exchange on domestic policy that will be similar in format of tonight's also this coming tuesday a case western reserve university in cleveland the vice presidential candidates vice president cheney and senator edwards will debate with by pbs colleagues when i pull operating for now by designer gary president bush from coral gables florida i'm jim lehrer thank you and goodnight steve henn and then they go through the end of this first debate with

sen john kerry think the president with his family and also begin our analysis now of the encounters mark fields but whether that they are the stronger than a lot of people the strongest allies one of you i think that there are number of personality defect moments he sometimes get rid of a thing we replayed over and over again and bush appointees on factual grounds with challenger and kerry held his own on the many parents and so i don't see this debate i think it carries their mission wanted to that was to make this as a luxury not about him as the bush campaign did not about george w bush and directed the worst record and what struck me as ellison the debate was with had two presidents one form won a second term in the last fifty years of service sector don't let them run away both of whom went on the strong variation of morning in america

things are better than and that's that's totally missing for this debate this is a bit of the president there trying to make it about there about senator kerry and what he says it carries a policy of missteps i did and i found that i get sad the compound at least seven times the president by those western union guys doing about sending mixed messages that until it became obvious to the mantra that they're sending mixed messages was the disqualification is what's clear to the president thing that i was a talk about to insist to insist and repeat consistency this is what we need and for carry zika says that's exactly what the problem is here in which you made the wrong decisions made clear consistent yeah i would say that quote the character messages build alliances that we run out on the closing statements that was the thing he mentioned war over and over again the summit's and so that these are the two choruses one from the president you need certainty from from carrying the coral the alliance's anymore summits to me you're more alliances more summits is not an

issue that gets people to change their mind the one final thing is that on the rock they really was not policy difference is going out into the future though disputes that where we've been but i do not think carried nor bush laid out policy differences about the notion that the next year as endy there really certainly heard of it and then i'd i don't argue that it became such a process or event but it did talk about credibility any any use that the first prisoner abuse it was because of the new brzezinski that anecdote about the data simply forgot it's going to be ever present a reform the gentle tug all about the presence of cuban missiles in the native russian missiles in cuba and that often show the photographic evidence of the girls say the word of the president states is all that i need i don't i don't need to see that and that would be unlike any credibility was there at the court the president and the president could not admit that he'd made mistakes or

miscalculations i mean the only explanation for them at the disaster and abetted and when a bloody deadly day today an anorak it was that we wanted to fast but it was interesting to hear the president talk about it continues to showcase his laurels as commander in chief and puppet with hard choices he set to make readers talk about what that the cost of american lives and hartwig says he had to make about staying the course in iraq back there in chief mantle that that here's the president at an advantage and so many cases that is did you think they purposely lang that on that and i think he did actually better than i've ever seen it before just to mention a variety of issues a certain level of knowledge only one tree has i talk to this person about the multi the five party talks to the six party talks with north korea is a rainy season and then there's a little was a whole level of knowledge i would say the one place kerry did not miss it and to not have him in this is a missed opportunity was on the level of management of the war practical matters when have you managed to talk about a little things that we talked about the humvees not being army that's a sort of concrete issue

the people to remember and i think if he carried that through the debate you would've had a much more effective time he left that scene just the way in the building alliance thing which is run strategy a rose up to the job or job carries a famous who he was they talked about he kept sliding into vietnam or for this some of them very obscure that the enemy is closing statements very directly say i thought my country as a young man and i will defend itself and it has to do a little information pieces given that what most of the day i think people probably well aware of rebuilding sixteen permanent bases back and he made he made it clear that there would be no continuing that there was a difference in the president didn't pick up one little stage and they don't like mike davis that's right follow up with that we know that we know continuing us and bob we have no further interesting contrast ad that the mismanagement of defending oil ministry as opposed to the uk offices of a rat what's political i think though the knob and it's up to people to decide to me the great thing about these debates is that not about the press and about the candidates about the voters and they had to decide

whether an effect at the president's argument that the war against iraqi is central and indispensable to the war against terrorism or as president as senator kerry said that's a diversion and i welcome diversion that has drained resources lives treasure and goodwill for the world from united states its mission against the water that was the clearest a particular student tonight if you had to gauge the debate based on how well they made their case to president bush went to senator clinton and i really think of the time to be honest at the kerry made that his argument the bush made in writing about consistency in the flip flopping argument that they both did they did very well build a kerry showed know nervousness about which surprised me is accountable president an n sync and showed no condescension and if it gets stronger as it went on with some lapses in the setup process obsession which i thought there would be political money when i thought the president tired clearly the

panel will come back to talk about this little bit more at the end that we won't be tired but first word i talked to buy that were republican and democratic partisans are saying and for that we go to race wise and we get that from c boyden gray is the former white house counsel to the first president bush he was one of the former president's chief debate advisors as well and donna brazil she was al gore's campaign manager she's now a chair of the voting rights institute at the democratic national committee and donna brazil john kerry had to stand with an incumbent president of the united states and make his case tonight the thing he did i thought he did an excellent job looking at to come across as a credible challenger he did that he had to get to the american people now in our talk about the issues they're very comfortable in the liver and his responses to the questions that it did both exceedingly well this was a debate with george bush when it pretty much is that we would have a clear advantage foreign policy that's a strong suit out george bush was supposed to put john kerry and defense and make him defend his boats make and defend his record it into that he was on the defense

respondents are very strong supporters that he mishandled the war and this was the wrong war at the wrong time slot but john kerry did very well and this is going to help john kerry show up some support that he's been losing over the past few weeks c boyden gray and the president returned again and again throughout the debate to a lot of the key themes in his stump speech was an effective tactic i thought it was very effective there are always two of those was a lot horror guy thought that it is the great but i thought my family did better there's always styled the substance another on the style question roseanne was more direct a more decisive and more fluid which is i think the surprise is he's not considered to be your ticket sales and care about selling more tickets and on the substance i think he put it carry on the defensive at the same time as he was able to make his own points of his own policy going forward into the future so he's a strong performance i thought from my cousin which really donna brazil mentioned that john

kerry was on the offensive on the war and the handling of the aftermath of the war you think the president managed to explain his decision making process and the various policies that have ruled out during that i thought he was much better putting carry around with us about what this is more about who gets the warriors against overweight sons been executed now the president i disagree with our comment on this program the president met with the big mistake was in his opinion that the war was won too fast they didn't get rid of enough of the bath a civilian and they didn't expect them to come back and that was a mistake he was very forthright in admitting this today as he has been in the past and i think that is the key to work understanding how he plans to work that it took to win this war on this is quite common consent of the debate that gets the largest audience the first one what was imperative for your candidate tonight and did he manage to

achieve those objectives just looking in at the remaining weeks of the campaign while this is clearly one of the most important issues of the selection foreign policy the president's current up mali and him on the war on terror as well as the president conduct an in the wire rack and i thought again john kerry he's a child and he's not the incumbent is to the incumbent that must defend his record john kerry basically said to the american people and they won in all of that will by john kerry he said look i have a plan he outlined his plan won and one time he was pete is several times and said he was very clear and i think that's what was cool of testy at times you say what you have with with his current president is more the same forwards when he outlined allies is a great you know probably too much alive because what if he would've just can't write down home to those soldiers and what they lack in what they miss and what they need and on to do the job affect when what he could do and he got around to it and i think that will help and go on into the next debate people will now listen to john kerry know if you know it has a plan he's clearly someone who could chances

president something that is supposedly his strong suit i was the president able to neutralize that rather than a very good job of laying out that the cemetery still doesn't know where his mind is about this war was the right war or the wrong war you can talk all you want about execution and he discusses a little but senator chemical is my mother this is someplace we should be or shouldn't and rose's quite right to say you can lead troops american troops put them in harm's way you can't lead foreign countries to help us if you're not sure well we were right to be there carries gone back and forth and went back and forth in this debate the first question was on terrorism and he said i'll do better interaction and then later in the bases this isn't about terrorism i don't know where i still unaware cemetery is on whether we should be there and i really don't know very quick was well i have to disagree strongly because that they say carry state say that upfront in his or the response to the first question that this was this war the

way in which the president went about it was was at least a thick and sicily two out of the bag and they've got tired and defending his position would raise point that we still don't know whether we belong where know and what we're going to make that clear and i think he i think he made a clip a looking up and get republicans on this the soundbites in the stump speech that they've basically have told the american people that they would carry say tonight is that is what i believe and as we have to say to say here's what i believe and the american people have to believe him at his word that he has a plant what republicans will continue to assist their daily stump speech carried his wishy washy he's a flip flop but i don't think that a warship tonight other issues did come up afghanistan north korea got for these things that can really move the lectern i think the iraqi issue terrorism issues the dominant issue in this campaign in this debate and i don't think the other issue is really matter that much that came up at the end of it i don't think they are important especially north korea the fact that now they

have no clue are weapons in the end what that means to this country that will also be that iran what the president is doing a rant they could be and what news but the world record no question is the number one issue can see both things went back to you things right now how tonight's debate measures up for the history books margaret warner has that and to help us for tonight's debate into some perspective we're joined by three presidential historians michael beschloss richard norton smith director of the lincoln library and museum and ellen fitzpatrick a professor of history at the university of new hampshire so hounded tonight's debate that would be richard measure up against decisive debates pascoe first of all what was it was in nineteen seventy six you didn't have an incumbent president make a gaffe prematurely liberating for one and holding his campaign at a critical moment it was not nineteen eighty four we'll have a counter walter mondale make a gaffe by in effect promising to raise taxes or defending that that position i thought

also bought for it was much better debate that we heard four years ago this was a debate about words nation's you heard george bush the nationalist debating john kerry the globalist and i thought terry did your his initials and educate enough he was channeling john f kennedy in nineteen sixty you know we could do that and he kept returning as it has an aggressive counter went to the issue of separating art from the war on terror i thought it was fairly effective on that but also a puppet boy's got almost reagan esque approach in repeatedly coming back with few basic defining differences between these two middle of parallels to say between this and decisive debates of the past it reached that barr well it didn't come out like that was about the size of i don't think this is a debate thats going to change many minds cause people to say she i see all sorts of things and george bush and john kerry that i didn't see before the one thing i think it really did was this these debates really draw a

contrast between temperance that's oftentimes the debate as well and i've oftentimes thought was a poster watcher at ai stephenson today john wayne because you kept on hearing carrie i think i'm almost at stevens selling wise say you know we're not doing enough with alliances with the un with coalitions we often criticize bush on process where bush was essentially say you know let's not deal with all this the important thing is what your route values are and a president has to be consistent what actors did you hear it this was a far more substantive debate that we had seen in american political history in many many many year and i think it's extremely important to remember that the last time the united states was involved in a massive very extensive effort at nation building in the context of war with an ongoing insurgency was in vietnam the period of nineteen sixty four to nineteen seventy two when that war was waged there were no presidential debates now that was a coincidence

we never had the opportunity to see this stark contrast run the american people have been given that opportunity tonight and as i was watching this style in the end doesn't have to try some of it is history does change that about senator kerry tonight was the smartest kid in a class and i thought the president was just like we were weary teacher occasionally brushing off and you also have to rise is trying to not like the other out kerry saying and a president has made all these mistakes doesn't deserve another term and george course i you know don't you know john you can't be president had become a commander in chief of the coupon change your mind and change your core convictions line that gets to you with big job that john kerry did and i just look at the polls was he's a challenger any had been passed the threshold of credibility for commander in chief for instance like ronald reagan did in nineteen eighty how often has that really been the task i

think it's often the test when there isn't an incumbent president and the challenger always has this difficulty it seems to me extremely difficult in this instance where you have john kerry saying this war was a mistake but he's not saying and therefore we will withdraw he's saying it was a mistake that has stood now effects and so he'd tear drop as sharp a distinction with this president as he drew when he was a young man active in vietnam veterans against the war and say and say let's go we have to get out of this and now so he had a much more difficult task and he was being very careful you didn't hear him say as he said as a young man in the early seventies it as someone to be the last man to die for a mistake as he thinks it was to go into iraq and she kept asking them were asked each one of them did he have a plan for getting out he has has it ever

happened that summarizes the presidential debate to lay out a policy like that what you that's one reason why ronald reagan's performance in it is regarded as a civic one not for counter because the it wasn't for polls but he had a very detailed plan that he actually been campaigning on before the contract for america was essential economic plan i'm it's interesting so you have a plan is not to have a plan and i have to say i think both candidates i suspect are a lot of people watch the whole ninety minutes and are still waiting to hear the point where we knew this for richard nixon had a secret plant and the war in vietnam and it remained a secret for a very long time because the war actually was isolated during his presidency before it was brought to announce i think you don't get that level of specificity we wouldn't expect that but i don't agree that the difference in the analysis of the cause was this good or bad to enter this war doesn't matter i think it does matter in terms of sizing up these two

candidates with michael another thing that that cemetery really had to deal with was the charge that's been out there and the voters seem to buy that he's wavering that he's a flip flop hurt that he doesn't know his own mind but again how often has the challenger could come in with that kind of deficit and how to tell what would carry deal with that as compared to previous twelve id perhaps the biggest example of that what about ronald reagan as richard was made on making the point my team at a lot of people felt that ronald reagan was a trigger happy person who was not very bright not very responsible didn't normally belong in the oval office he is that debate to make that case quick question of around the fiftieth year richard is was at any moment tonight memorable enough that as historians you will all be remembering at say four years you know so that's a good thing because world writing about the fact that sound bites proud of substance i don't think there are many soundbites from tonight and i'm not sure that's a bad thing that wasn't very much show business which i think is wonderful

because that usually tends to overwhelm everything ocean here i think this is a debate that you could listen to for ninety minutes and i'm proud to be an american i thought they carry hod close to a singer when he said i may make them the state in my words but you made a mistake in intervening in this war on on the other hand i thought that bush reiterated very well his position that we can't have our own we can speak with two voices to our allies michael and richard thank you oh well thank you margaret and some final thoughts from mark shields and david brooks i was struck by ellen fitzpatrick scum and marquette this was a this is a very substantive a debate that also by boyden gray sky that this the president score points on style which was a new job i thought it was substantive but i thought we obviously that the agreement that could be no cutaway shots about the cameras as showing the non answer and lucy and how they responded to somebody else as it was served it was ignored totally and we saw the president a

few times cho what what looked to be some obvious anger especially early on the debate i think you know the geva called a draw i call a close split decision to carry out if that's the case this this is the area that with a bushel what most of the day this is the year of the president's greatest fights terrorism that in foreign policy that so they sought to draw there that probably is there is a help for kerry heading into turf its was friendly to him on domestic issues healthcare medicare job creation and those is a problem for kerry and i think so many that say the conversation any guide and i think the strangest moments of a campaign our sources i mean one thing we ever thought about too much is the difference on substance and how they define the enemy when kerry talked about the enemy was exclusively of pride amazon them on many others jericho bush talks more about a global ed article and so that is one

substantive rose mbeki when i went out of his way carried it to say this was not about saddam right or not even about in this ideological radical is all right what about this organization helped either just one other quick stylistic point it struck me that carries bush steptoe pretty much the question at the expense quite often repeated itself where spirits and the five or six points sometimes drifting sort of far away from the question and so that's that is that human right there one that will repeat itself and it will show you five or six points in to wander off and their descendants little while let's hear very quickly do you think that carries got at a steeper hill or flattering mr oh i think that anytime a challenge it was on the same station the president and goes off you know that the worst is a draw according to david it it certainly makes things easy it is when that carries back and for the president yeah i think he's very as a better advantage because he'd been expected to be a smarter scary to sort of say elizabeth david brooks mark shields thank you talk to get them around i will see you all online and tomorrow evening for a regular program where will have

further analysis of reactions to the night's debate i when i pull thank you and good night major funding for the newshour with jim lehrer and provide higher taxes because beethoven sees as instances of the sixties grant or dedication to serving their clients has made them one of the world's global accounting organization is proving that when people really love what they do grant thornton a passion for the business of accounting and by the archer daniels midland company and spca communications

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