1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-06-07; Part 2 of 4

it's been people are different fifty thousand fifty thousand dollars bet that he wasn't it is possible to the best of your recollection an actor reconciliation <unk> water usage of state that are dispersed to him the sum of one hundred thousand dollars as nasty were you familiar with the activities of the

border in terms of what i do now i have what information can you give this committee from those records and what i want to have gathered since you left the committee from old father of the reporter he evidently internal turn over thirty five thousand dollars of those funds to mr levine which produced the the aggregate figure that was used in the trial the funds that were made available this money was used for the campaign i know there was a story about a student named douglas dobro there's a convoluted chain of custody here believe the support is to reach two to four in the midst of parole for up for a major sponsor i wear whatever

those activities were you wear any other extended activities besides those two instances in this particular category to you stated that a report on finances was given to mr stance on one or two occasions did not aren't state workers parsons has a few individuals if they told you oh i i'll review questions on the disbursements to the border and at one time and that this matter up with standards which are not yet surrogate and there you also get this matter up with disabilities that correct yes and there mr gooden told you in turn that day

you were not to question the requests are at all apparent to make a displacement as they were requested was that correct yes and there did you file or prepare any reporters to which were doing this morning just as important factors or more do you provide any copies are many reports that the white house knows any other reports out i understand that and i think has happened that drove up in terms of a the report of all we put together as a reconciliation that prevents a period by category for instance a two hundred fifty thousand dollars want a category one of a hundred thousand category two and so forth well you well for the category one category do what their particular information did you really

is that's five but we're more definition we're listening to the first verse and a bit a political security i can say that these reports and reflective the disbursements april the seventh <unk> at the border and to the others saw a report mr golson interesting which without the white house or any reporter ari one who received a reporter on the disbursements besides <unk> fans and you never gave any of these reports mr mitchell organist magruder you know whether or not it's just as big as you ever

mitchell to anyone else other than just dance and they're really tell them how you would his resume as gay journalist who is receiving it you are understanding an instruction that news ten the reason that a master mitchell was consulted on these expenditures by mr gruber i understand the reason that he knew of the dispersants to masculinity and to mist of water

for some organizational sense it is inconceivable to me that he would not be in a general sense of his age were doing their proper job where up this kind of situations certain mr stanton to get to me on two occasions that was the source of his confirmation that i should continue on making these traditions of the service initially some nachos mr mitchell well these dispersants you say whether he had any knowledge and did you know at the time or what purposes <unk> it was going to use this money have you since then after paying for what purpose he did use this money i understand from the convention and the mortgage servicer donors' money was used in support of that particular operation and support a clandestine activities

and use and reflect that in his first one hundred and eighteen thousand dollars in american history the church which came into mexico and then they were taken to miami hundred and fourteen thousand is that correct your server i did receive that money how much of an issue as you back up and twelve thousand dollars that's got to the twenty five hundred dollar now i was into understanding than an estimate you know true on the revisions before and after the people or seven it wasn't your understanding that mr michel mr miller approve of august wilson's made by you before

a trailer from the nineteen hundred and sixty eight campaign i'm not sure the pictures of her and maybe karen morton another dimension so i think people came out in nineteen sixty eight funds that were turned over unmade and the triple seven three probably will come out about five hundred and eighty thousand dollars most of this was written directly to an existing permit two hundred and thirty five in your letters this is the money that money would be well received here

but to the rest of the immigration reform you have twenty million dollars zachariah hughes dated an enduring and they're out what was your policy with respect to contributions that about which people call to pick them up we're using essentially any available people we have trouble forced the time for instance the intelligence administrative assistant do a secretary stands in the number of treatment is pretty or for instance to visit their contributors to pick up their contributions

so during those last days i would say there's a dollar amount and i may have been misunderstood in the previous deposition on this and there was one case where we could not do nothing worthwhile of a hundred thousand dollar which have big money in mexico showed up anyway your situation we are all things you indicated the commissioner to the committee in your deposition our interview that there nose less hectic days that they're here you're a limitation of pick up was a hundred thousand dollars over it in one i know

mm hmm human being i mean you're just you people are celebrating yeah and his natural is to combine force was out there it was very active in our

headquarters every time he would go back on weekends or you may very well brought money back in the last month whether it was a couple of the west there's a much more in the finance committee now when you went to mr mitchell voters who explain the situation and determine that the fbi were downstairs waiting would you please be a little more specific as to who accompanied you there and what conversation took place for you in there or one of the conversation and what transpired when i was in india

jonathan michel martin was there and i do not have a good sense of it was obvious i think it what it is that you what you want to say these men are here and i was concerned that what i could not believe that they were not there to talk to me about finances visibility in the watergate a video well i fully appreciate this moment you were great concern because the fbi were downstairs and it may not remember i can appreciate your concern when you walk into mr

michal voll but now you know i have no direct recollection of what i said other than prayers nineteen years or whatever i say that in a context for it as i'm sure that kind of the way it was presented by a report first really what is an unwinding a civil affairs compound and they're doing it right four unions are did you engage in any discussions with friends and what you might say to the fbi and the us are when that when american immigrant happen to

develop so that the i assume that mr lew by suggesting i see john mitchell was and i don't know five or six days yes sir the morning has seventeen family was a friday morning and i did not join until the evening the ninth which would be the sunday night from that point on the travel industry and their disease joining world i want to leave you i was i think really good

listener at the fundraising meeting that some of our people who are operating on behalf of a field specific duties what conversations did you have with his dance with respect to rile the watergate affair and cash dispersed months took place during the sort of flair up i think it's the principle emphasis in terms of what was going on in newspapers and what the level of concern was with a terrorist act now they're doing it i mean it's in the morning it's the individual who

transported out from dallas texas to washington and i don't know in terms of the conversation that previously made it what it was was there any meetings between the president and his just dance with respect to campaign financing it was so beautiful you do in your reports to the white house or can dispense reflective and balances periodically out what was in the campaign fund and how levees then reports transmitted to the white house

forty different view it's b you stated that you were aware that they were spending about some of the ninety percent of his time on the finance committee matters as counsel were you aware of how he was spending the other ten percent of his time of those are winning when he joined the finance committee and again to me that you have a continuing project for the political side and i use to confirm that fact no discussion took place at the nature did it ever our curiosity that question that it might be performing other tasks

that would lead you to believe that you stated that the disbursement of ten thousand dollars and then there was to recruit a team of american energy to disrupt the lowest candidacy in california i mean it was a question of science i had heard something to do with the last campaign in california for your meeting with mr erlichman i believe it was on the on june

twenty eight at the white house yesterday oh you're going to face after the reporting of the cash registers and that's my concern i think it was in the nature and was a mile away and just immediately to admit i think there's a problem i did not disappoint i'm sure mention names are leveling allegations and in what context if you have a place that observation that there was about a week four

hundred dollars i don't know money i think we have a situation here there is no accountability there's a suspicion a possibility that there's a connection and of what i was trying to play whether i do not know the point of trying to master atlanta mr chabon was that i thought it was a more serious problem than any individual i've seen

either in the white house or in the campaign it appeared to be taking it at that point so in your observations to mr erlichman on june twenty thirteen tried to connect the existence of cash on the person of their workers with the distributions that you had made mr liddy there's just a lot of reasons that was arrested in those conversations with mr erlichman relating to this whether it was specific you didn't have such a conversation so certainly in the context of that award and it was then and that if you had any personal problems that he could help

us out that he would be willing to do anything to help you with his personal problems with a user and he also said that he would take up with the president and he was certain that this would be covered by one major say yemen and after you read at the white house maybe a problem here my position personally would have made it i would take executive privilege until after the election no i got there and what someone's trying to put the time into context i interpret that as a statement on his

part he is but it never has a statement that they want out of work for the president to run the domestic council and that campaign there's no problem it was at the white house we were going through

he was twenty nine ms bishop and who solicited who are these conversations but in terms of what happened i think quite possibly jim first of music i was picked up a bit off that day by particular story about extreme angry and upset and i'm

sure those circumstances it concerns around it in my mind and i saw you saw me and did discuss this rare oh yes was it as a result of your conversations with mr chabon that he invited you to meet with him at the white house a whole lot the next day and you did meet with human remains which a sailor or just for conversation and jeans and was it as a result of your conversation with mr chabon that you then at two o'clock on the same day soul <unk> so they were they were the result of a conversation i had with his deputy chemical the night before

i think i was expressing their political principles system's hull was like oh you're john harbaugh want to have this information i do not know as a specific images see a lot which indicated he expressed any to get an inventory would relay my concerns with europe and who was present at this conference with mr mcmahon i don't know and you know hurt indicated in your testimony before this committee that are going to try to get you to do certain things and then you in turn indicated that reasonably

would be up for an appointment that you would personally come and testify against any confirmation now you so he was the yeah the case of the ruinous interview read you figure he could very well have these representations were anthrax legitimately think that there was a discrepancy there was no question of resolving the fact that it is the only individuals specifically requested of me that i consider an illegal act now you also mention that and your return from california that you had a drink with her and that he in turn suggest to you

that they're both of you as it was to try and set the us attorney's office and why why wasn't even reinforced there when there was nothing in the northwest have been made a huge fistfight quarter presenters tell us why was he so anxious to take you there well as the running man a liaison between the grand jury in the watergate people people associated with the finance committee i was quite amazing the fact he would only in light of my conversation with bob martin in response to the first suggested they already indicated it just the way it builds many certainly prepared at that time and the way it was suggested to is the second time there was no question what did you ask him why he wanted to the

total us attorney's office about invitation from the us district attorney it is timeless it the grand jury essentially with moving up from the ocean a lot of the campaigns starting with secretaries and people were people that it was only a matter of days before you will principals who had knowledge of police forces money would come up and i think my guess would be that would be an attempt to head off that you have an organized disclosure as opposed to individuals going and separately with different story thank you guys ms agins taking off any further inquiry what was the specific purpose over to undergo you to go i don't know

the critical issue of the market coming up an appointment i believe you stated that he had after this meeting to our listeners to titus and that accounts for that is that you have the only dispersed approximately forty thousand to mr libby and in what context of this conversation rise with respect to go into mr price with this information a plea he really suggested the going down of the tail end of that proposition getting together to resolve this suggestion about thinking about it intended mr titus that had asked him to invite you to go to the us attorney's office

and you assume that mr mcgrew was acting on his own i mean it was with no indication on his parka on for what happened then other individuals campaign on it as an issue of it the pen there is well these

questions questions the question was the first place so a lot of i do not believe that we even mentioned that there's i started it was a bit that this is continuing you can see why you're

welcome this is this is in the oral you recall was nineteen seventeen six thousand dollars now there's a question and related to one yes sir

there was a tremendous amount the question is why or december and you know what are you going to say i mean

you're welcome as april do we know why and so on i'm fine general assembly recently that's right yes or

no you know i read that you know and so for many many

years early period mr mcgregor estimated set of assessing what was an agency account with mr henry buchanan day cpa was doing work for us he understood that a certain portion of this morning i think it was something in every two thousand dollars a month i do not know he supports mr griffin oh yeah

i myself yes i would say with one exception of the first and possibly be like rewrite of finance a matter of saying it and i'm still matter as well be the other matters for many lives mm hmm all right oh yeah the

question has been and revealing the testimony that you've given to the committee and and anticipating some of the testimony i expect when i receive them other witnesses later i've tried to establish your years where there might be potential conflicts there might be elements of uncertainty mark in complete explanation and meters deep well let me ask about him finally confessed in advance that i may have hiv are subjective answers i think it's impossible that i am concerned that this moment for a clear definition the

quality and let's go to your warnings your expressions of concern for mr chabon mr erlichman was oh mr mitchell picture researchers give me some warning was stern tends to sort of the expression out of date and easy as that between those two they're going to be sensible center as i've tried to point out that i have a very great deal of trouble putting together my precise data on what factors affecting that

the nature of those meetings were extremely cordial they're that i consider my friends so we talked over range of other things the introduction in each case was about family has a vacation syria i would say probably just because not my character i do not believe that i made the hard sell anymore i think there's a decent does think there's a problem i do not believe at that point on a notch or the precise sequences even weather in fact this computer it made its approach to me at that point so i'm saying is that there were certainly no it was not a warming in the sense of substantive information it was a huge question of concern because of how i felt intuitively and perhaps one of the ball from there i am not characterize these

meetings at something where i said you guys got to do something about this specific problem or outside and initially that was not that kind of proposition eight very low key report i'm sure you understand why it is that it was something for a time as this committee presumably will affect the likelihood of the appropriateness the conduct that others and response the information you and monitor my mind and your attitude in the audience go further warnings are nations so it's important for me to know that quality being subjected quality concerns as it relates to the future testimony of same as chip mitchell stay different and does the description you've given us which obviously is subject to many interpretations but that description of a general warning mr mitchell right because it was an afterthought

you know it's all over i'm going my way of orchestral on the way out to be sure that you understand why what i've done and therefore less concerned somebody somewhere a major decision between the donors anonymous when a difficult decision very close to the president to make the decision to go and we discussed is in terms of the land government officials we have a tie and then there's one final question that is even more

deadly subject to commit a way of reporters working in asia the questions that vessel on the subject obviously lead to one master equation and that it was in your judgment but the man to whom you talk to shape and i'll just mention smoke the man paul responding to reject an appropriate way to the quality or the intensity of your admonition wanting our conversation i would answer that question top leader was quite clear that potentially there was great damage coming to the campaign is that nothing else guilt by association because the campaigns are very logical place to looking for suspects in the case of the body of the opposing party headquarters

but then just ended it was a net negative response a positive response in the sense that i know the money situation i think that's right i'm not sure that we are responsibly well there that i can't resist picking up when you said the bombing of each other's headquarters you have any

sense that something like this nice question those conversations that you believe he met a belief that there was a difference of opinion as to the amount that you just referred to your

testimony yesterday in response to questions about me you concerning conversation you had witnessed the low testimony you've just come back from your interview with the fbi and use that i believe in as the group came down from i also following that interview to find out what i said and what matters came up at that point he indicated today and i do not have the precise words sense of the meeting as a candidate was made it was daybreak reference something that but the libyan money is the problem it is a political sense that we can just come out we're going to have to come out with a different figure i said as i recall i said if there's a problem i cannot see any difference

whether it is two hundred or the conversation yes sir i guess it's a question of degree in the case of mr mcgregor it was a very hard sell blatant kind of approach in the case of mr lewis' very low key and he backed off a parapet but that is a correct statement to the best of my knowledge of the sense of that meeting slow or so the early part of your testimony you didn't mention the name francis ran as a person who was a co signer i understand of it was cast a deposit boxes do you have of your knowledge are getting information whether it was the rain i decided i believe i knew it at the time

i have since been told that he is a relative i'm not sure if i know i understand it's a brother morally for the record the dollar oh yes i'm well thank you thank you

this band that's after almost seven hours of testimony the senate committee has completed its examination of his long as long indicated that although he was very upset about some people around him he did not lose faith in president nixon arts programs and a moment where testimony from one of them and slung gave large amounts of cash to her report public television's coverage of the watergate hearings will continue after this pause for station identification the great coverage of these hearings is provided as a public service of the member stations of pbs and public broadcasting service the point is the

power pose and pike continues its coverage of hearings by the senate select committee on presidential campaign activities you again correspondent jim lehrer as soon as senator evan

devil's the committee backed ruler after a lunch break a reporter will be questioned by assistant committee counsel david doors we do and his role model breaking the law do you like it

just order your full name and address a sentiment and its religious order doesn't address is three two or one mediterranean right now california with porter icu represented by counsel of counsel then that one so you have a brief opening statement california so the

years after twenty seven years having never been involved in any political campaign or other political activity i was on air and excited about the opportunity to help in some way for the re election of richard nixon for the white house and the white house working in the opposite direction my committee for the reelection of the president was the organizers say the candidate program director of schedule i was also responsible for organizing all celebrities entertainers and athletes for the campaign almost all my time at the committee for the reelection of the president was organizing and directing the activities of the several

things stories in magazines mentioning my name a few of these stories have been very accurate the record show that i make no comments many reporters were newsman over the past several months this may or may not have been wise on my part but i was trying to protect my wife and my three children from the consequences of any excess of publicity it cooperated fully with bulky federal prosecutors and members of the investigating is that this committee and i have made full disclosure i also with state that in cooperation with the federal prosecutor and this committee i did so voluntarily and in the case of the federal prosecutors i peered at my

own request at the sikh community <unk> so i have made no deals i have agreed only to tell the truth i will answer all questions with me by this committee regarding testimony forgiven by me i mean i'm the only one i have no i have no knowledge of involvement i'm the president of the united states i mean i say this whole affair is having a devastating effect on my personal life because of the unfavorable publicity i've been terminated from a lucrative position in private industry a

fact which in turn has caused the forefront of substantial last purchase of a new home in california this is my situation your opening statement you refer to sort of candidate program could you please explain to the program unveiled as are very briefly program was a program that involve me the efforts of about thirty five congressmen senators governors cabinet officials there who would appear and during the campaign the program with a look at that group as a resource and to maximize it through scheduling and certain campaign appearances on behalf of the president

you know ordinary and in connection with your do you ever ask to give cash to mostly via saws and lester to do this when was the first time we saw last year in december of nineteen seventy one with murder mystery to tell you julie ruder told me that mr libby was going to be taking on dirty tricks and other special projects and that mr libby would be coming to me from time to time the requested funds and i went to in turn asked lester sloan for the funds and turn them over to his delivery there's the libyan fact that you for once you get on how many occasions i would say probably seven or eight agents and was the approximate american tradition of the libyan each of those occasions the amounts of very important

probably for anywhere from five hundred dollars all went to one time i think six thousand dollars he requested it was usually in the two to three thousand dollars friday april seventh nineteen seventy two hundred in total the new furnace facility that's mainly thirty to thirty five thousand dollars probably closer to the thirty thousand dollars figure thirty thirty one now in march unlike the seventies it was really a changed positions the correct answer and what was the change truly lap his duties as general counsel at the committee for the reelection of the president and became general counsel of the finance committee to realize how many of the payments which you fb